In 2002 - 2003, together with like minded residents, I attempted to find a solution for traffic speeds and volume on Holyport Road, which already at that time was severe.
In "Topics" - "Speeding on Holyport Road" I show the various leaflets that I produced, and reading through these in order gives a history of how that went.
In summary RBWM agreed to have a survey of what people wanted; I encouraged people to express their opinions; this resulted in RBWM drawing up plans for speed cushions; then Bray Parish Council stopped it.
A decade later it is clear that the Parish Council's solution - the electronic "Slow Down" signs that I considered from the outset would be of no use, are in fact useless. The minor improvements in signage and road markings have no effect. Traffic volume has increased and will increase further. The problem is now acute.
Below are some comments made recently by four residents and in "Topics" - "Speeding on Holyport Road" there is a petition requesting that BPC and RBWM work together with representatives of the HRA to find a solution to enforce a reduction of speed. Do any HRA members have concerns on Holyport Road speeding, and does anyone wish to get involved?
The following email conversation took place on 19th June 2013;
1ST RESIDENT
I have just noticed that they have put in a rather large 40 miles sign at the end of Holyport Road to the Windsor Road junction - so much for trying to minimise street furniture!! Particularly as I couldn't see any post marked with 30 till a very small one obscured by foliage just before Cadogan Close. I am disgusted by the indifference shown by the Parish Council to requests for speed control and their arguments about doing nothing in a conservation area when Bray has been inundated with humps, signs and a 20 miles limit. I think we should ask for a pedestrian crossing from the bus stop across near the school and a slow sign as well as taking out those horrible 40 miles limit signs and include one more visible 30 miles sign and to my view include a 20 miles zone all around the green!
__________________
2ND RESIDENT
I absolutely agree with everything 1st RESIDENT said. I was walking up Holyport Road last week, with my son in the pushchair and a guy raced past me at at least 50 miles an hour. Imagine if a child going to school stepped out in front of him. It doesn't bear thinking about. I have already written to the council about speeding on the Holyport Road and received a pathetic response saying that they'd done a survey, and almost no-one had been caught speeding during the survey, so as far as they were concerned there wasn't a problem!
I am willing to write another letter if need be!
______________________
1ST RESIDENT
Thanks 2ND RESIDENT for that -
You know I was wondering whether this is time for a petition. My immediate neighbour is outraged and has told me about a past accident where a woman was severely shaken up (fortunately no physical injuries) because a driver coming from Moneyrow Green hadn't even stopped at the junction!
I am of the view that a petition covering the whole of Holyport Road and perhaps beyond to draw the attention to the fact that people are totally ignoring the speed limit and as I have shown some of them don't even care about it because it is not reinforced either visibly with signs or physical bodies - i.e. police officers, to act as deterrent.
I heard from someone that last Monday that he had to swerve and go on the verge because a 4x4 was coming from the Green at such a speed round the corner that he was almost skidding and taking over the other side of the road.
This is a story that will run and run if we don't act now.
I think whether we are 20 or 200 the HRA should be behind this otherwise I will be sending a letter to the Maidenhead Advertiser and writing (again and again) to the Parish council - and so will you and anyone else - and we might as well be all united behind a petition to the local borough as well as the parish council and the police and anyone else you can think of.
_______________________
2ND RESIDENT
Yes 1ST RESIDENT - absolutely I think a petition is definitely the way to go. I know that Andrew Cormie has also had past communication with the council about this point and also didn't get much of a response from them.
My mum and dad nearly got knocked over by a car that was going too fast round the bend at the top of Holyport Road shortly after we moved in here, and that was 8 years ago, so nothing has changed in that time!
I could collect signatures. I am sure I could also recruit one of my neighbours to help me who was part of our group when we were trying to get the gateway planning permission refused.
________________________
3RD RESIDENT
I think this is an excellent idea. If nothing is done the situation will only get worse as it already has over the past 16 years that we have been living in the village. I don't understand why Holyport should be distinguished from Bray and Fifield both of which benefit from 20 miles and
hour speed restrictions and speed bumps in areas remote from their respective schools.
I live on the Holyport Road and everyday see cars speeding down the road. I've even been overtaken when obeying the speed limit! Over the last few months we have had to park our cars from time to time on the road, something that we normally avoid at all costs due to the speed. One of our visitors actually had his van driven into by someone speeding along so fast that they didn't recognise that it was stationary until too late to stop in time.
Then someone said to me that they didn't agree that I should park my car on Holyport Road as it was disrupting the flow of traffic.
_________________________
1ST RESIDENT
Thank you 3RD RESIDENT for your encouragement.
Your last paragraph is very symptomatic of what I fear most about trying to find a consensus in the village - people are very quick at judging and this topic needs our support for the safety of all concerned.
2nd Resident and I had further discussions and this lunch time I've taken a few photographs seeing how many cars would trigger the speedometers. Within a few minutes there are a multitude of cars that trigger the device and a good handful who are visibly doing something like 50 miles/hour.
The problem with these electronic devices is that firstly they advise you are speeding only after the event - you may not know it is a 30 miles/hour area (although I believe the law (highway code) says that if you have street lighting than the speed limit must be 30 miles/hr because it represents a built-up area. Wikipedia tells us that: "...unless an order has been made and the road is signed to the contrary, a 30mph speed limit applies where there are three or more lamps throwing light on the carriage and placed not more than 183 m apart. I have not seen signs showing a 30 miles limit at the entrance of Holyport Road, from the Green, so will drivers assume that because of the absence of street lighting the speed limit is not restricted, hence the maddening speed with which some drivers negotiate the bend and then have to break further down the road?
I'm of the view that we should have a written petition and 2nd Resident thinks people would prefer to sign online. I would think the two are not incompatible and we can knock on doors as well as notify people of a petition online.
___________________
ANDREW CORMIE
In 2002 I tried to get traffic calming on Holyport Road. RBWM consulted residents and the consensus was for speed cushions. RBWM drew up plans for them, but in the end BPC had it stopped. They enlisted comments from Police, Ambulance service and Fire Service - who do not want them as Holyport Road is regarded as a "strategic route" for Police and for Ambulances and Fire Engines.
I have also asked for a pedestrian crossing - this request is always refused.
I have also asked for better lighting on the stretch between Stroud Farm Road and The Green. - Always refused.
It appears that some Councillors have concern that any restriction on Holyport Road will cause increased traffic on Ascot Road.
I have also tried to have traffic calming signage on Holyport Road - always refused.
Further, the surface of Holyport Road is in a bad state and we need a quiet road surface.
3rd Resident - other neighbours of yours have also had their car run into (and I believe it was written off) when parked outside their house.
Also, a few years ago at night, a car was parked under the lamp-post between my home and my neighbours. The driver had decided to park there overnight and was in the car trying to sleep. A car ran into it and both cars were written off.
SEE TOPICS - SPEEDING ON HOLYPORT ROAD
As of 16th July 2013, we have 26 signatures on the petition. The following are comments from some who signed, and the comments marked * , ** and *** were received by email;
The 30 mph sign is placed too far up. Traffic comes round the bend at 40 mph and then fails to brake or reduce speed. The 30mph should apply all the way from the Green not just from the junction with Stroud Farm Road.
If we do nothing to curb the speed of traffic as well as its volume, should there be an accident, who will admit responsibility?
It is set at 30 mph for a reason. I, for one, abide to the Law. Why can't everyone else. The flashing speed beacons don't work as a deterrent. The only thing that will reduce the speed is a Gatsby !
Traffic calming at the entrances to the village green would be welcome
Let's change something for once before somebody is killed or seriously injured. Proactive approach rather than reactive to a tragedy as is typically the case.
I walk along the footpath at the side of Holyport Road on a daily basis to take my children to school. I am very glad that we are soon to move house as it is a highly dangerous road to walk beside with 3 children. Drivers RARELY obey the speed limit. It's a long, narrow straight with NO formal crossing and sometimes we have to wait a long time to cross the road. In my opinion, the speed limit should be reduced to 20 and a proper crossing put in PLUS speed bumps. It's a miracle no one has been killed on this road.
Holyport Road passes close by to a school.
Children walk along & cross Holyport Road, so the traffic speed is critical to the safe of the children.
Cars often ignore the 30 mile an hour speed signs. There is a blind bend at the Holyport Green end near to where children to and from school need to cross the road.
I feel the speed signs do make some people think about their speed but I do think a Welcome to Holyport Village with an awareness to the speed limit would make a big difference.
Something needs to be done about this road as soon as possible. We have young children and elderly people using it every single day, and someone passed me the other day doing between 50 - 60 miles. A child, or adult for that matter, wouldn't stand at chance at that speed.
Consideration should be given to providing Speed Cushions which will slow down smaller vehicles but not affect ambulances, fire engines and buses which can straddle the cushion without having to ride up and over it.
* I was walking with my husband on Monday along the Holyport Road, my husband nearly got his head knocked off by the wing mirror of a van going at speed and driving close to the pavement. This is very dangerous. There is also a problem with overgrown bushes which means pedestrians have to walk on the edge of the path.
COMMENT BY A Cormie - Yes - in the past I also have almost been struck by a vehicle mirror. Holyport Road is too narrow for much of the traffic that uses it. Bray Parish Council have advised that they are acting to get the hedge cut.
** New Member joined on 5th July and has following view on this;
"Have joined as I would campaign against any speed bumps in Holyport Road. I was against them some 10 years ago and nothing has changed my view. I was also against the reduction in speed limit from 40 to 30. I have lived here for 27 years, walked both my kids to the primary school and see little wrong with the current set up. Far too much is made of speed as being the cause of accidents rather than the carelessness / inattention of the driver. Pedestrians have to take responsibility for themselves."
Crossing Holyport Road from the end of Blind Lane to go to the shops is particularly hazardous as it is difficult to see round the bend towards Holyport Green. Traffic coming round this bend from the Green frequently trigger the 30 warning sign thus indicating that vehicles are exceeding the speed limit. Walking down the footpath towards the Windsor Road to cross further down does little help reduce the risk.
Pedestrian crossings required and speed reduction.
Dangerous to cross with my 4 year old twins to go to school. The bend near the shops and the speed of the cars makes it a 'dash' for the other side and hope we time it right.
Once someone is killed it will be too late.
*** Received on 15th July 2013 - "Two weeks ago myself my daughter and two of my neighbours nearly got killed while crossing from the pavement between Stroud Farm road and Langworthy over to the other side to walk down the footpath (Blind Lane). A car coming out of Stroud Farm Rd. let us cross and as we got three quarters of the way across a taxi driver came flying around the corner from the green direction at God knows what speed and had to skid to a halt. When starting to cross there was no sight of him. I shouted once safe on the path "It's 30mph" where he got out of his car and we had a few words etc. Then the next day whilst just about to walk down Stroud farm road I heard a screaming and a banging noise one of the mothers from the school and her two children where pushed and trapped in the over grown nettled hedge on the corner as a lorry that had come from Bargain Booze was turning left onto Holyport Road but was so large his wheels were across the path and as he was turning left his back wheels were all the way across the path and unknown to him he was squashing the family into the hedge for their own safety. The driver did not stop and the family were very upset.
These I am sure are normal day to day incidents around Holyport - everyone has a story to tell and until someone is killed it will keep happening."
In "Topics" - "Speeding on Holyport Road" I show the various leaflets that I produced, and reading through these in order gives a history of how that went.
In summary RBWM agreed to have a survey of what people wanted; I encouraged people to express their opinions; this resulted in RBWM drawing up plans for speed cushions; then Bray Parish Council stopped it.
A decade later it is clear that the Parish Council's solution - the electronic "Slow Down" signs that I considered from the outset would be of no use, are in fact useless. The minor improvements in signage and road markings have no effect. Traffic volume has increased and will increase further. The problem is now acute.
Below are some comments made recently by four residents and in "Topics" - "Speeding on Holyport Road" there is a petition requesting that BPC and RBWM work together with representatives of the HRA to find a solution to enforce a reduction of speed. Do any HRA members have concerns on Holyport Road speeding, and does anyone wish to get involved?
The following email conversation took place on 19th June 2013;
1ST RESIDENT
I have just noticed that they have put in a rather large 40 miles sign at the end of Holyport Road to the Windsor Road junction - so much for trying to minimise street furniture!! Particularly as I couldn't see any post marked with 30 till a very small one obscured by foliage just before Cadogan Close. I am disgusted by the indifference shown by the Parish Council to requests for speed control and their arguments about doing nothing in a conservation area when Bray has been inundated with humps, signs and a 20 miles limit. I think we should ask for a pedestrian crossing from the bus stop across near the school and a slow sign as well as taking out those horrible 40 miles limit signs and include one more visible 30 miles sign and to my view include a 20 miles zone all around the green!
__________________
2ND RESIDENT
I absolutely agree with everything 1st RESIDENT said. I was walking up Holyport Road last week, with my son in the pushchair and a guy raced past me at at least 50 miles an hour. Imagine if a child going to school stepped out in front of him. It doesn't bear thinking about. I have already written to the council about speeding on the Holyport Road and received a pathetic response saying that they'd done a survey, and almost no-one had been caught speeding during the survey, so as far as they were concerned there wasn't a problem!
I am willing to write another letter if need be!
______________________
1ST RESIDENT
Thanks 2ND RESIDENT for that -
You know I was wondering whether this is time for a petition. My immediate neighbour is outraged and has told me about a past accident where a woman was severely shaken up (fortunately no physical injuries) because a driver coming from Moneyrow Green hadn't even stopped at the junction!
I am of the view that a petition covering the whole of Holyport Road and perhaps beyond to draw the attention to the fact that people are totally ignoring the speed limit and as I have shown some of them don't even care about it because it is not reinforced either visibly with signs or physical bodies - i.e. police officers, to act as deterrent.
I heard from someone that last Monday that he had to swerve and go on the verge because a 4x4 was coming from the Green at such a speed round the corner that he was almost skidding and taking over the other side of the road.
This is a story that will run and run if we don't act now.
I think whether we are 20 or 200 the HRA should be behind this otherwise I will be sending a letter to the Maidenhead Advertiser and writing (again and again) to the Parish council - and so will you and anyone else - and we might as well be all united behind a petition to the local borough as well as the parish council and the police and anyone else you can think of.
_______________________
2ND RESIDENT
Yes 1ST RESIDENT - absolutely I think a petition is definitely the way to go. I know that Andrew Cormie has also had past communication with the council about this point and also didn't get much of a response from them.
My mum and dad nearly got knocked over by a car that was going too fast round the bend at the top of Holyport Road shortly after we moved in here, and that was 8 years ago, so nothing has changed in that time!
I could collect signatures. I am sure I could also recruit one of my neighbours to help me who was part of our group when we were trying to get the gateway planning permission refused.
________________________
3RD RESIDENT
I think this is an excellent idea. If nothing is done the situation will only get worse as it already has over the past 16 years that we have been living in the village. I don't understand why Holyport should be distinguished from Bray and Fifield both of which benefit from 20 miles and
hour speed restrictions and speed bumps in areas remote from their respective schools.
I live on the Holyport Road and everyday see cars speeding down the road. I've even been overtaken when obeying the speed limit! Over the last few months we have had to park our cars from time to time on the road, something that we normally avoid at all costs due to the speed. One of our visitors actually had his van driven into by someone speeding along so fast that they didn't recognise that it was stationary until too late to stop in time.
Then someone said to me that they didn't agree that I should park my car on Holyport Road as it was disrupting the flow of traffic.
_________________________
1ST RESIDENT
Thank you 3RD RESIDENT for your encouragement.
Your last paragraph is very symptomatic of what I fear most about trying to find a consensus in the village - people are very quick at judging and this topic needs our support for the safety of all concerned.
2nd Resident and I had further discussions and this lunch time I've taken a few photographs seeing how many cars would trigger the speedometers. Within a few minutes there are a multitude of cars that trigger the device and a good handful who are visibly doing something like 50 miles/hour.
The problem with these electronic devices is that firstly they advise you are speeding only after the event - you may not know it is a 30 miles/hour area (although I believe the law (highway code) says that if you have street lighting than the speed limit must be 30 miles/hr because it represents a built-up area. Wikipedia tells us that: "...unless an order has been made and the road is signed to the contrary, a 30mph speed limit applies where there are three or more lamps throwing light on the carriage and placed not more than 183 m apart. I have not seen signs showing a 30 miles limit at the entrance of Holyport Road, from the Green, so will drivers assume that because of the absence of street lighting the speed limit is not restricted, hence the maddening speed with which some drivers negotiate the bend and then have to break further down the road?
I'm of the view that we should have a written petition and 2nd Resident thinks people would prefer to sign online. I would think the two are not incompatible and we can knock on doors as well as notify people of a petition online.
___________________
ANDREW CORMIE
In 2002 I tried to get traffic calming on Holyport Road. RBWM consulted residents and the consensus was for speed cushions. RBWM drew up plans for them, but in the end BPC had it stopped. They enlisted comments from Police, Ambulance service and Fire Service - who do not want them as Holyport Road is regarded as a "strategic route" for Police and for Ambulances and Fire Engines.
I have also asked for a pedestrian crossing - this request is always refused.
I have also asked for better lighting on the stretch between Stroud Farm Road and The Green. - Always refused.
It appears that some Councillors have concern that any restriction on Holyport Road will cause increased traffic on Ascot Road.
I have also tried to have traffic calming signage on Holyport Road - always refused.
Further, the surface of Holyport Road is in a bad state and we need a quiet road surface.
3rd Resident - other neighbours of yours have also had their car run into (and I believe it was written off) when parked outside their house.
Also, a few years ago at night, a car was parked under the lamp-post between my home and my neighbours. The driver had decided to park there overnight and was in the car trying to sleep. A car ran into it and both cars were written off.
SEE TOPICS - SPEEDING ON HOLYPORT ROAD
As of 16th July 2013, we have 26 signatures on the petition. The following are comments from some who signed, and the comments marked * , ** and *** were received by email;
The 30 mph sign is placed too far up. Traffic comes round the bend at 40 mph and then fails to brake or reduce speed. The 30mph should apply all the way from the Green not just from the junction with Stroud Farm Road.
If we do nothing to curb the speed of traffic as well as its volume, should there be an accident, who will admit responsibility?
It is set at 30 mph for a reason. I, for one, abide to the Law. Why can't everyone else. The flashing speed beacons don't work as a deterrent. The only thing that will reduce the speed is a Gatsby !
Traffic calming at the entrances to the village green would be welcome
Let's change something for once before somebody is killed or seriously injured. Proactive approach rather than reactive to a tragedy as is typically the case.
I walk along the footpath at the side of Holyport Road on a daily basis to take my children to school. I am very glad that we are soon to move house as it is a highly dangerous road to walk beside with 3 children. Drivers RARELY obey the speed limit. It's a long, narrow straight with NO formal crossing and sometimes we have to wait a long time to cross the road. In my opinion, the speed limit should be reduced to 20 and a proper crossing put in PLUS speed bumps. It's a miracle no one has been killed on this road.
Holyport Road passes close by to a school.
Children walk along & cross Holyport Road, so the traffic speed is critical to the safe of the children.
Cars often ignore the 30 mile an hour speed signs. There is a blind bend at the Holyport Green end near to where children to and from school need to cross the road.
I feel the speed signs do make some people think about their speed but I do think a Welcome to Holyport Village with an awareness to the speed limit would make a big difference.
Something needs to be done about this road as soon as possible. We have young children and elderly people using it every single day, and someone passed me the other day doing between 50 - 60 miles. A child, or adult for that matter, wouldn't stand at chance at that speed.
Consideration should be given to providing Speed Cushions which will slow down smaller vehicles but not affect ambulances, fire engines and buses which can straddle the cushion without having to ride up and over it.
* I was walking with my husband on Monday along the Holyport Road, my husband nearly got his head knocked off by the wing mirror of a van going at speed and driving close to the pavement. This is very dangerous. There is also a problem with overgrown bushes which means pedestrians have to walk on the edge of the path.
COMMENT BY A Cormie - Yes - in the past I also have almost been struck by a vehicle mirror. Holyport Road is too narrow for much of the traffic that uses it. Bray Parish Council have advised that they are acting to get the hedge cut.
** New Member joined on 5th July and has following view on this;
"Have joined as I would campaign against any speed bumps in Holyport Road. I was against them some 10 years ago and nothing has changed my view. I was also against the reduction in speed limit from 40 to 30. I have lived here for 27 years, walked both my kids to the primary school and see little wrong with the current set up. Far too much is made of speed as being the cause of accidents rather than the carelessness / inattention of the driver. Pedestrians have to take responsibility for themselves."
Crossing Holyport Road from the end of Blind Lane to go to the shops is particularly hazardous as it is difficult to see round the bend towards Holyport Green. Traffic coming round this bend from the Green frequently trigger the 30 warning sign thus indicating that vehicles are exceeding the speed limit. Walking down the footpath towards the Windsor Road to cross further down does little help reduce the risk.
Pedestrian crossings required and speed reduction.
Dangerous to cross with my 4 year old twins to go to school. The bend near the shops and the speed of the cars makes it a 'dash' for the other side and hope we time it right.
Once someone is killed it will be too late.
*** Received on 15th July 2013 - "Two weeks ago myself my daughter and two of my neighbours nearly got killed while crossing from the pavement between Stroud Farm road and Langworthy over to the other side to walk down the footpath (Blind Lane). A car coming out of Stroud Farm Rd. let us cross and as we got three quarters of the way across a taxi driver came flying around the corner from the green direction at God knows what speed and had to skid to a halt. When starting to cross there was no sight of him. I shouted once safe on the path "It's 30mph" where he got out of his car and we had a few words etc. Then the next day whilst just about to walk down Stroud farm road I heard a screaming and a banging noise one of the mothers from the school and her two children where pushed and trapped in the over grown nettled hedge on the corner as a lorry that had come from Bargain Booze was turning left onto Holyport Road but was so large his wheels were across the path and as he was turning left his back wheels were all the way across the path and unknown to him he was squashing the family into the hedge for their own safety. The driver did not stop and the family were very upset.
These I am sure are normal day to day incidents around Holyport - everyone has a story to tell and until someone is killed it will keep happening."
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